Overcoming Burnout

Transcript performed by A.I. Please excuse the typos.
00:00
you might feel really emotionally exhausted or detached from your work, detached from patients. You’re really having trouble focusing on what you’re doing, staying present. You’re needing a lot of caffeine or sugar to like push through. Those are big markers that I see with burnout. Singing along to music stimulates your vagal nerve, which causes more regulation to your nervous system. So just literally singing along to a song you like on the way to work can be a huge

00:29
needle mover for a lot of people.

00:33
This is Dental All-Stars, where we bring you the best in dentistry on marketing, management and training.

00:42
Welcome to Dental All-Stars. I’m Eric Vickery, president of coaching at All-Star Dental Academy. And I’m very excited to interview our guest today again, Kathleen Wine, our very own functional medicine certified health coach. She’s got a background in just root cause healing and advanced training and functional blood chemistry lab ranges. She works with individuals navigating chronic fatigue burnout. Hey, there’s our topic for today, right?

01:12
and complex health concerns, helping them find clarity, build better habits, and find wellbeing with less overwhelm. Her coaching is shaped by both professional training and her own lived experiences, offering grounded, passionate support for those ready to reclaim their energy and resilience. Cleen lives in Northern California with her husband and son and has been on her own healing passes. 2015, she’s thrilled to be part of the All-Star team, as we are as well, and help

01:40
Dental professionals prioritize their own wellness and resilience. So thanks again, Kathleen, for joining us here on Dental All-Stars. We value your input in this topic. As coaches, we see pretty consistently, whether it’s team members or the dentist, really just getting to a place of burnout. And it feels weird. Like, I don’t even understand this. Like, nobody saw it coming. Nobody saw it coming at all.

02:09
And then next thing you know, burnout is here. So how would you, as we start to peel the layers back here, how would you say you’re able to differentiate between burnout and just being tired? What are dental professionals gonna need to do to recognize those early signs before we’re off that cliff and really into burnout? Sure. Yeah, that’s a good question.

02:37
Generally, just feelings of tiredness, just to put it simply, would be resolved when you get enough rest and enough sleep. You know, maybe you get to take some time off. You feel better after you catch up on your sleep. And that’s going to be more like tiredness, whereas that deep fatigue and burnout is something that’s not resolved by a good night of sleep. You you wake up, you might feel really emotionally exhausted or detached from your work, detached from

03:06
patience uh or just your daily life, uh like a loss of motivation, feeling like you’re not having the drive that you used to have, even to do the things that you love or enjoy. And it can also really encompass like feelings of irritability or uh you’re really having trouble focusing on what you’re doing, staying present, you’re needing a lot of caffeine or sugar to like push through. Those are big markers that I see with burnout or uh like chronic fatigue. uh

03:36
So like when I get hangry, you notice that irritability. I notice it. Oh wow. Why is my tone like that? Why do I feel frustrated right now? So similarly in a burnout, it maybe has a physical representation of irritability. Like you said, um, trouble focusing, dreading the work day. I call it like, I don’t know, Sundays, whatever you want to call it, right? Just in the

04:04
Yeah, the week’s about to start and I really don’t feel like going to work tomorrow. is, it is not only physical, emotional, there’s this like mental struggle of saying, Oh, Oh, I don’t want to go to work tomorrow at all. What is that about? And so I think first of all, you check the boxes here. If you’re listening to this and going, okay, am I resonating with any of those symptoms that Kathleen’s mentioning here?

04:34
to go, okay, am I approaching the phase of burnout? So how are we getting there? What are the common contributing factors to fatigue and burnout and what that you’re seeing for people who are in, I call them high performing individuals, but people who are in high demand workplaces like dentistry. Yeah, there can be.

05:02
I mean, for any one of us, but especially when you’re in that high performing environment, there are a couple of main factors I see. I mean, a huge one is just sleep quality and sleep hygiene. You know, it’s not necessarily the number of hours you get, but the quality of sleep you’re getting can be a huge factor contributing. And then another aspect of that really contributes to energy levels declining or sleep declining is your circadian rhythm dysfunction. That can be a huge one. So if you’re

05:31
I mean all of us deal with it, but especially when you’re working full-time in an office you’re in artificial light all day You’re not getting outside seeing sunlight at all that can really throw off your sleep rhythms and your energy levels in general that impacts way more areas of the body than we realize and then just on a Kind of emotional level to just feeling disconnected from joy and meaning in life so if you feel like you don’t have a lot of purpose or uh

06:00
Even a lot that you’re doing outside of work to create a sense of meaning in your life can be a big factor of that when you’re not making space for play or making space for what you enjoy, for hobbies, for the people you love. That can really contribute very quickly. We’re just not made to live disconnected like that. um Chronic stress load is a huge one. mean, the stress level when you’re in this high performing position, this feeling of needing to be perfect, perform perfectly, do everything perfect for every patient. It can…

06:29
it can be a huge factor to that really deep level of stress. And then uh even speaking also just to being in the work environment, the posture that you’re in, a lot of this work that you’re doing with patients can be very physical work. So that physical strain can really contribute to feelings of pain, feelings of fatigue that also lends to burnout. And then thinking about, again, a physical factor that we talked about.

06:56
in the last podcast is just blood sugar roller coaster. So if your blood sugar is going up and down all day, really only managed by caffeine or sugar, you’re getting that burst of energy for an hour. And then you crash after that. That also really contributes to long-term burnout and fatigue. And then those are like some of the big lifestyle factors that I see that if you get one or two of those back on track, a lot of people feel a lot of relief. Um, but if you have a lot of those

07:24
factors kind of figured out and you’re still dealing with a lot of feelings of burnout or fatigue, there can be a lot of deeper root causes at play too. And that’s when, you know, when you have a lot of that dialed in and you’re still really struggling, that’s when you might work with a functional practitioner and see some more relief. Cause there can be a lot of deeper root causes. Like a lot of inflammation can contribute if you’re dealing with chronic infection or high toxicity levels, nutrient deficiencies. Those are really ones you want to cater to.

07:53
very personally to what you might be dealing with. But that first list, we can all really benefit from really dialing in. So I’m taking notes and looking at things. I want to make sure everyone hears this. So sleep. Maybe that’s on your list. uh Lack of sunlight. I know Abby and you like this sort of topic. you know, I am indoors artificial light all day long.

08:22
And now that the it’s darker, longer, it, I don’t get to go out. take the dogs out in the morning, whatever. I don’t get to go out and just look at the sun in the general direction in the morning right away. So I have some questions about that one. It’s like, well, how do I, like I’m working while it’s light out. What, you know, what am I supposed to do there? Maybe it’s, maybe it’s go for a walk at lunch or something like that. But we’ve got some, discussion there. So lack of sunlight. know.

08:48
blue light exposure with you and the coaches. We’ve been talking about this a lot and what can we do at night to not just have screens in our faces that’s really messing with our sleep and what can we do? I know there’s some solution there too that we could talk about. You talked about join meeting and that that’s what struck a chord with me. I don’t know if you can confirm this or not, but I find that I need a seven day target. Like I’m go really hard this week and I mean work week, but I’m going to go really hard and then I’ve got this I’m looking forward to.

09:17
And I need to have that thing that I’m looking forward to as my reward for a job well done. And now I provide that to myself and it’s a gift I give myself and it could be date night, could be going golfing, could be, uh, I got a haircut yesterday. You know, could be things that I deem as my reward. Do you find that there’s a rhythm to that? There’s uh a day span. Does it have to be every day? For me, it’s weekly. I’m just curious about that one.

09:46
Yeah, that’s a really good point. mean, it totally depends on the person and I think it depends on the work you’re doing too. But that’s a great way to look at it. If you look at it in cycles of weeks or even once a month, something bigger that you really look forward to and like doing. That can be a great way to build in some of that sense of care, sense of purpose and meaning in your life. And, you know, I see people struggle to do this because it might feel selfish or unproductive.

10:15
You know, but what’s crazy is I’m sure you see this and when you build this in yourself, you’re way more productive when you build in those pockets of rust and meaning in your life, because you have something to look forward to. So you’re able to really give it your all, take a break, unplug, really reconnect with who you are, and then step back and refreshed and work in a much more productive and balanced way where you’re just happier. You’re enjoying life more. This also runs parallel to team meetings.

10:45
where we find that dental offices feel like, no, I have eight patient hours a day. I need to maximize all of that. And we’re not going to stop that to communicate. Wait a second. So we’re going to keep doing things wrong or, or incorrectly or inefficiently instead of having a meeting to become efficient in that time we see patients. We find that about every seven days, once a week, we need an hour of time with our team to block out and go, Hey, let’s work on X. Let’s.

11:15
get better in this regard. Let’s review this thing. And for some reason, there’s a real roadblock here in dentistry and maybe other professions as well, where we don’t carve out the time to be better, to improve ourselves. And I think this really is similar. I think we have to block time in our schedule and say, where am I? Where’s my me time? Where’s my healthy time? And I think you’re right. I think some people might need that daily because there are so much closer to burnout.

11:44
And others can go weekly because they’re, finding balance in that. And we can go down a bunting trail of my work schedule and, and dentals and all that, but that’s for another time. All right. You also mentioned chronic stress load, which we’re talking about the blood sugar roller coaster, which we talked about last session. So if you, if, if anybody wants more on that, go back and watch the last podcast we did. Uh, and then long hours in one posture, my, my aura ring will go, is it time to stretch your legs? go.

12:13
I don’t have time to stretch my legs. We me alone. Yeah. Yeah. um can’t, I can’t, um, stress enough that I’ve got to, and this is for me, I got to get up, go over here, literally do lunges or squats or something in my office in between calls and sit back down and do this. I think, uh, hygienist assistance, the admin we’re sitting a lot and we gotta be really careful of that.

12:43
Would you say that even when I’m sitting doesn’t seem stressful, but when I’m sitting in a long time, that still is one of the factors that’s leading to that chronic fatigue. It’s just because your body’s not in movement. Is that, is that what I’m hearing? Totally. I feel like we’re really designed to be moving, working our muscles, moving our body. That’s part of even just keeping your lymph flowing. You have to be moving to keep your lymphatic system flowing. Otherwise you get really stagnant. And I can’t remember if I mentioned this before, but

13:12
I’ve heard nowadays that people say that sitting’s the new smoking, because it’s so detrimental to your health to be sitting in one spot all the time. You haven’t said that because that’s the first time I’ve ever heard that. Wow. Yeah. I’m a smoker. I’m a smoker. Well, our world’s not set up for healthy movement. You really have to kind of go against the grain to care for yourself well. Something that I always remind clients of is it doesn’t have to be huge. You know, you don’t have to go from sitting all day every day.

13:41
to you’re gonna take your only lunch break and go run for an hour. You can really incorporate it in in tiny ways and that’s more effective really when you start super small and maybe your step tomorrow is you’re getting up on your lunch break and you’re gonna walk outside for five minutes and that’s it. Literally set a timer on your phone, five minutes will go so fast and you’ll feel better if you literally walk around the parking lot for five minutes. Instead of scrolling on your phone, that really adds that.

14:08
If you do that every day for a week, I’d be really curious how you physically feel, how your body feels, how you emotionally feel, just taking that break. Yeah. And so now we’re getting into habits and habit stacking. We’re getting that connection, Abby’s world with therapeutic coaching and how do you not, why are we doing this? So I imagine in, and I’m saying imagine even, even though I probably know this, but I imagine that you help clients figure out these root causes.

14:37
that are making them say, I’m irritable right now. I’m frustrated. Okay, let’s get into it. So in your coaching process, you’re probably going through some sort of checklist to identify what those root causes are. And then it’s now let’s do an action plan to solve. Yeah. Yeah. That’s one of my favorite parts of the onboarding process is I send clients a really comprehensive intake form that they really need to sit and go through really their whole health history and current lifestyle.

15:06
And a lot of times, literally, don’t, before I even talk to a client, I look through that and I’m able to pinpoint one or two, if not more, that we can really start. And that’s really exciting because when you find one or two places to start, where you’re like, okay, I see a lot of potential for growth here. We can really make some small shifts that will move the needle. And then the client starts to feel better. It’s really encouraging. I’m on both sides. It’s really fun to be able to help support them. And then for the client, it’s.

15:36
So encouraging for them to be like, wow, I did this intake form. We’ve done one session and I have a few takeaways. That’s always going to make a huge difference in how I feel. Yeah. The ROI and our health. So funny, we look at numbers and production and patient scene and how healthy we’re getting other people. We also aren’t going to be able to keep doing that if we don’t put ourselves first. How can I take care of others if I don’t take care of myself first? I think that’s really what is the underlying theme here. So let’s talk.

16:04
coaching, let’s talk practical steps. And I’ll put a big asterisk on this because we don’t know what your cause of burnout is. So these are just general things that I I want us to talk about. And every podcast, I really want to have something people can walk away with and go, Oh, I can apply that my life. With the asterisk here is we don’t know what’s the issue. Therefore we don’t know what the solution is with these could be potential solutions. Would that be okay? All right. So let’s talk, let’s just talk potential solutions, even if people don’t have much time in the dental world.

16:34
You know, we’re working really hard Monday through Thursday, you know, 730 to 530, just running late in the lunch. What are some things that, that, that us, those people in dentistry can do to really recover or prevent burnout in a sense? Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, just touching on, you know, we don’t know the root causes for everyone, but what’s huge about this is I always say most people know what they need to do for their health.

17:03
it’s a matter of just actually doing it. So you probably as you’re listening to this list will be like, ah, that’s probably me. Like for me, a lot of times my sleep, I know it immediately. I’m like, I gotta work on my sleep. I really gotta work on getting to bed on time. So most people, you give them a list and they’ll be like, yeah, this is my area. So I feel like most people can pick out one thing that will really help them. And then touching again on just like keeping it small. I see that’s like one of the biggest challenges with clients is when they wanna

17:31
They really wanna feel better, they really wanna make a change and they try and overhaul their entire lives. And it’ll last for a week if you try and change everything. But if you really take it small and you change your habits in these really incremental, what, literally what’s the smallest thing you can do to make a difference in your health right now and sustain? That’s what moves the needle, cause you’re able to continue it. It doesn’t feel stressful or overwhelming. It doesn’t add stress to your already stressed out life. Yeah.

17:58
But I mean, touching on just from that perspective of tiny habits for sleep in circadian rhythm, like we talked about stepping outside for literally five minutes during your work day instead of sitting down in a break room instead of staying in your office, literally getting outside, seeing the sunlight for, or even when it’s cloudy, like getting outside for five minutes, getting fresh air makes a huge difference. And then when you are stuck indoors, mean, Eric, you and I have talked about this. It’s so important when you’re on a screen at night.

18:27
to protect yourself from that blue light exposure, because it prevents or limits your melatonin production. So if you’re having issues falling asleep, if you’re getting that blue light exposure in your eyes, your brain’s not going to be making the healthy melatonin levels it should to help you fall asleep and stay asleep. So you really want to, like, I just think we’ll continue to see over the years how detrimental blue light is for our health and artificial lighting is. It’s one of those things that you can’t ignore. No, sure, it’d be great if you could.

18:57
live by candlelight and read books and just spend time the evening. But most of us are going to be on a screen at some point, two hours before bed, you know? So that’s where I really like like em these blue light blocking glasses. I have ones for computer that are like the yellow lens ones. But getting that darker red lens and wearing those two or three hours before bed, it makes a big difference. It really moves the needle. Two or three hours. Okay. Yeah, that’s

19:25
That’s preferred, you know, as much as you can, it’s better than nothing really. And there actually is a really good app in terms of tangible steps. If you’re really interested in this circadian rhythm concept, it’s called MyCircadian. It’s the app name, just one word, MyCircadian. And it has a lot of good resources on the importance of healthy light exposure, when vitamin D is available from sunlight, when the sun rises, when it sets, you can really dig in there. It’s kind of fun if you’re a data nerd.

19:54
So it’s not tracking you necessarily like my aura ring or a Apple watch or Garmin watch or a whoop bracelet. It’s more, Hey, here’s some things you can do as a guide. Yeah. Yeah. It’s based on your location. So it’ll show you based on where you live, when your vitamin D levels are available. You can log sessions of time outside if you’re trying to build up your vitamin D levels and it can tell you how much vitamin D you’re getting each day.

20:22
There’s some educational videos on there and it actually has a lux meter so you can point the camera at whatever your light source is. So if you’re inside looking at a light bulb, you can view it there or if you’re outside and it’s cloudy out, you would just point it toward the sun and it’ll show you how much actual light exposure you’re getting. And there’s certain levels you want. I can’t remember the exact number, but first thing in the morning, you need sufficient lux. You need the light to be bright enough to encourage your body to wake up.

20:51
And indoor lighting is almost never bright enough for that. You really need outside lighting, even cloudy first thing in the morning. I was just going to say, so it’s raining and cloudy here right now. So you still go out and it’ll give you, and you mentioned, you said Lux meter. What’s that? Lux. It just measures the intensity of light, how bright the light is. Yeah. And you would be shocked. I’d be really curious. You should use it later, Eric, and compare what it is when you look at a light bulb. It’s going to be like under 500.

21:21
And then even on a cloudy day, it’s going to be over 2000 of this light measurement. Even when it’s like we’re both in overcast weather right now, it’s still going to be better for your brain to get out, get some sunlight exposure, even when it’s rainy outside. And I’m hearing you say first thing in the morning, which again, a lot of people are driving to work and it’s dark out and they’re in the office before it’s light out. How do they, what’s a hack? What’s something we can do? I mean,

21:51
I’m going take D3 and what is it? K3 or K2 or whatever, know, but forget about pill form. What I got to go back outside. Can I look through a window? I can’t have a window in the way. My car windows are in the way. What is something that we could do? Yeah, that’s a good question. I mean, if you are driving in the sunlight, having windows down is always going to help because you’re going to have different, it blocks certain forms of UV when you’re looking at it through a window.

22:19
Windows open always helps. Obviously that’s not always, you’re not always able to do that in an office setting, but literally taking that five minute break and stepping outside and taking a breath of fresh air or even less than that. Literally walking outside for two minutes, taking a quick breather, looking out the sunlight. That’s going to make a huge difference, even if it’s tiny. I’m going to challenge everyone to do their huddles outside. Seriously. Get outside.

22:47
You know, taking a break in dentistry is really hard because it’s just patient on the hour. So work with your coach on how to create breaks. have a, we have a solution for that one. Okay. Good. And then we were also talking about uh joy and meaning and a rhythm there. So what’s your, what’s your coaching hack for that? I’ll always go back to just finding small ways on a daily basis to incorporate it into your life. You know, you don’t need to pick up a new hobby that’s expensive and time consuming.

23:15
You can if you want to, you know, that would be great too, right? Totally. Yeah. But I mean, there’s great little ways, like when you’re driving to work, have a favorite playlist. I mean, there’s there’s information about how singing along to music stimulates your vagal nerve, which causes more regulation to your nervous system. So just literally singing along to a song you like on the way to work can be a huge needle mover for a lot of people. um And then I had a few other notes here. Oh.

23:45
You know, taking a moment to even send someone a text with a note of gratitude, something you appreciate about them, that sense of connection or, yeah, just connectedness with people around you can be huge. A quick walk outside, obviously we touched on that. And then making sure that you do shift your routine and your schedule in ways that you are doing things you enjoy in life. You know, we just can’t get around that. You have to prioritize what you love, movement you enjoy.

24:14
the people that bring you life, you need to make space for it because it, you know, it literally will shorten your lifespan if you don’t. It’s, it’s a high priority to do that. So I want to go back through these. Uh, I’m making a note, uh, so some things you’re, you’re touching on our coaching clients have heard in our coaching session. So when I talk about mental toughness, champion mindset,

24:40
We’re talking about in the morning, seven minutes of positive music. What’s your playlist you run through? I have a playlist and it’s playing while I’m making my favorite thing, my chai in the morning. You know, so I have that. That’s my, my treat daily. Like you’re talking about daily, pretty simple. And then you mentioned appreciation notes. So we, this will be a nice challenge for those listening who have gotten away from it. Are you writing your appreciation notes to your team members weekly? Maybe.

25:08
two people on your team every week, a Monday and a Thursday or Tuesday and a Thursday type thing where you’re texting or handwriting even better, an appreciation note to someone. Send a voice memo if you’d like of what you appreciate about that. We just don’t do that enough. And it’s, it’s great to give that away because what I’m hearing you say is that it brings joy to me as well. And then you also said, and this goes back for our, our clients that are in coaching, learning about disc and personality profiles and EQ and strengths and all of this.

25:38
Some people are recharged with being around people. That’s me. I love being around people. And some people are recharged by solo time. That’s my wife, Abby. So I’m like, let’s go. And she’s going, let’s not go. Let’s go unplug this way. And I think people need to understand their version of recharge. Is that fair? Yes. Oh, that’s really good info. And I was just talking to someone about this recently that I feel like our society is not…

26:04
built for or that appreciative of introverts, like it’s okay to need to step away to recharge and it’s okay if that’s how you’re wired. And it’s really so valuable to recognize that, especially if you’re in a job where there’s a lot of output, there’s a lot of relational energy going out, recognizing that you need to step away and take little time to be by yourself and pour back into yourself is huge. It makes a huge difference. So I think that’s a really good point too. It’s not always gonna be.

26:33
calling someone, going out to do something with a friend, it might be stepping away for time by yourself to recharge. So there’s tons more coaching hacks that I know you get into. We’re not going to spend more time on that here today. That’s why we have you available to our clients. But I know that you’ve spent a lot of time dealing with your own chronic fatigue, your own life journey in that. so personally, from your perspective, what you’ve gone through, what do you think would help?

27:03
dental professionals rebuild that resilience that they’re looking for. Yeah. think some of my own personal takeaways, it’s been really a process and journey for my own like high achieving mindsets and attitudes a lot. You know, I was always kind of like high achieving, focused on getting it all done, being the best at school, being the best at everything I did. And it really is a wake up call when you hit that extreme stage of fatigue or burnout.

27:31
and you start to realize, okay, you know, this is not what life is all about. I can’t get so dug into my performance, my perfectionism. need to really bring it back and dial in and say, what is my body telling me? Why am I in this place? And what is it trying to tell me it needs? And not trying to push through. I feel like that can be the tendency when you’re very type A and you hit this state, you can be like, if I just push harder, if I just…

28:00
If I just do more and I do all the things, then I’ll recover from this. But it really is pulling back, looking back into yourself. What do I need? How do I recover from this? And what support do I need? That’s huge. mean, I think especially when you’re in Taipei, a lot of us can tend to be like, I’m fine. I’ve done enough research. I can do it by myself. But that’s like part of the process is really coming to terms with the fact that when you need support, you need support and don’t.

28:27
wait until you’re so burned out that you’re ready to quit your job and move away to an island and never speak to anyone again. You know, we don’t want to, we don’t want to get there. Sounds nice. There’s a story there and I won’t, I’m not going to go into it, but yeah. So you don’t know what you don’t know. And you know, the mastermind or the conversation, the coaching conversations, we call it, you know, high level thinking partnerships.

28:53
those create solutions in conversation. There’s just things there that you haven’t thought about that you won’t know to do if you’re not in conversation with someone. And if you’re going to keep pushing and grinding the last five years, we’ve noticed this in this world, we’ve seen such an increase in burnout. I, I use the analogy of, you know, I’ve talked about this before, a whiny road in the fog. There’s no guardrails and there’s a cliff on both sides.

29:19
And you don’t know you’re off the cliff until you’re off the cliff. You don’t know you’re in danger of going off the cliff until you’ve already fallen into burnout. And there’s, need guard rails in place. And some of those guard rails are, it’s someone like you. It’s, how you schedule things. It’s your habits. And sometimes there’s things in your past that you need to push through too and get through. just know that our, our goal here at All-Star is to support each of you in all aspects of your profession that

29:47
we can touch on, meaning not clinical. We’re not gonna teach you how to do a crown. But we’re gonna look at everything in your life and say, how do we help you create really healthy habits so you can keep doing what you love doing? And if you’re all feeling like, hey, this is a problem, I’m running into roadblocks, I’m breaking down more, I’m more irritable, I’m not finding joy in what I do, then please reach out. Just send an email to Heather Nottingham, heather at allstardentalacademy.com.

30:16
And she will just talk with you. She loves to hear what you’re going through and what on the All-Star Dental Academies buffet is appropriate for you. And we’ve done everything in our power to make it affordable for you so that you can be a part of the team, be a part of the family at All-Star and get the support that you want. Kathleen, anything else you want to add to this at all that we didn’t touch on there? Like, that one thing I want to say before we wrap up. I mean, this

30:44
This topic is so near and dear to my heart because I think as a culture and society, we just don’t create space to be whole people. We really think that we have to push through in life and push through and perform. And um one of the phrases that I like that my husband uses is we are human beings, not human doings. We don’t always have to be doing and achieving. Really part of being able to progress in life is caring for yourself. So it’s just vitally important. This stuff you can’t.

31:13
You can’t get around it because it’ll hit you at some point or another. And it’s better to not run away from it and avoid it. You know, I’ve, I’ve just experienced firsthand. So it’s, I love this conversation. I think it’s very important. Me too. Me too. So true. I’m so glad that those that have stuck through this podcast and listening to it will get some resolution. Abby says, my wife says, funny, the same human being at home is the same human being at work. They’re, they’re doing the same things in different places. So, uh, yeah, yeah, we’re, we’re.

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speaking the same language here. So for those of you listening, thank you so much. Remember, continue to like and share these podcasts. Give it to someone that you think would really benefit from listening to this. And again, reach out to us, allstardentalacademy.com. Just email Heather, heather at allstardentalacademy.com. And until next time, go out there and be an All-Star.

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We hope you enjoyed this episode of Dental All-Stars. Visit us online at AllStarDentalAcademy.com